Posted by Jenny (220.127.116.11) on April 18, 2003 at 13:58:55:
In Reply to: Re: sometimes I run... posted by Leo (18.104.22.168) on April 16, 2003 at 05:56:40:
> > ****Well, I am a self-identified 5w4. I also took the MBTI and came up INTP (close on F and very close on J). Above all, I am analytical and a thinker. My need to be alone and think about things leaves me with a feeling of isolation, which can definitely be a problem for fives. I think as I am getting a little older, and thus gaining more wisdom, I am realizing that people's acceptance of myself is just my way to maintain a rational order in the outer world. I want to connect with other people in meaningful ways (as a four wing), but cannot sustain a relationship with someone based on emotion alone. Intellectual stimulation and having my "alone time" are my main objectives in a relationship. I have assumed hitherto that I was a four, becuase I can get caught up in the emotional fray of life. But that is only in periods of confusion and isolation, etc. When I am at my best, I am working alone focusing on analytical problems, discussing issues with fellow thinkers, or simply existing...observing life and its foibles is a great experience for me.
> I think that you are focusing on when you are at your best which is not a four think to do, so that gives weight to that side. I find isolation tends to settle in because my feelings are very complex. They always have so much in them that most people get bored listening to me explain them.
> I have found it a great help to boil them down. A five's problem often comes in meeting people half way. I experience this often as not knowing which piece out of the seas of analysis I can produce the person will find relvant and useful. Also it is very difficult to advise only to report.
> The way you can make a real emotional connection is to say 'Well, I don't know what result you want, what do you want out of this situation?' t helps focus both you and the person you are talking to and reduces the frustration of wasted communication.
> > ****I think when fives get into a state of despair or worry, they can only see far ahead if they are completely healthy and wise. I am 22, and have been essentially a loner (with a few friends at a time) my entire life, and have only experienced loneliness recently (the last couple years). That has lead me to desire human relationships, but also fear them because they are certainly uncertain. I have an enneagram book that describes the different levels of healthiness in the types. Fives experience more and more anxiety and distress as they disintegrate towards seven. I see myself as probably an average five. I have problems, but am not completely messed up or anything... I just don't know how to deal with emotions and with most people (people without depth). This is why I focus so much on what people think, because I feel like the only way we will get along is for me to have control over the situation, because I have found that most people cannot be trusted. I have recently begun experimenting with extroversion more and find it helps me achieve that inner consistency I have longed for. I can have people like me on a superficial level, but at the same time I can feel free to be myself. Also, I am basically learning that you can learn something from pretty much everyone, even if it's only the way "not to be". The more wisdom I acquire, the better I feel about life.
> See above about how to get more out of people. I would question your statement that 5s 'disintegrate' toward 7. This comes from the fallacy that stress=bad and security=good. Stress means whenever things become high tension, I always go 7 when I'm having injections or when I have a fever I disappear into my head to avoid pain... It's an ability not a curse. On the other hand I have to be very careful when I think I know people that I don't ride roughshod over them. You always have to keep in mind that you migth be wrong. Security is not just feeling safe it can also be arrogance and complacency.
***Very true...In "Personality Types" by Riso and Hudson, they describe the five disintegrating to seven. Here's an excerpt:
"Starting at level 4, Fives under stress will begin to exhibit many of the qualities of average to unhealthy Sevens. Average Fives tend to retreat from connection with others and from activities in which they fear they will be unable to accomplish. Thus they become increasingly narrow in their focus and concerns. The move to Seven can be seen as an unconscious reaction to this shrinking of the Five's world albeit in the scattered, hyperactive discharge of anxiety found in the average to unhealthy Seven."
I can definitely identify with this description. What do you think?
> Return comments are always welcome.
> > > Post any questions below. And give me a reality check (see.)
> > Sorry, posted everything in between your message. Write back with your comments, if you want. :) Jenny
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